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WinXP completely shuts down

 
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Cyc2u

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:57 pm    Post subject: WinXP completely shuts down
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Hi all. I just got a new PC about 3 weeks ago.
Everything was fine but once in a while, when I click the IE icon in my bottom left side taskbar, the PC shuts off. It doesnt reboot, it turns completely off. Speakers, monitor, printer and cable modem stay on.

Now at first i thought maybe its a overheating problem, but i play high end games on this for hours and never have any problems at all. The processor has a built in fan that gets stronger as it heats up, but it has never acted strangely while playing any game. This only happens when im not playing a game and only when i try to start IE from the taskbar. And not all the time, it has happened 5 times since i owned it, so every few days or so on average.

It happened today and i noticed something. There was no TV or radio on in the house so it was dead quiet. From inside the PC case I can hear a strange noise, almost like a low whistle. its very hard to hear but I can notice its different from other times.
I clicked IE, and it shut down.

Does anyone have any clue what might be going on here? The PC starts back up OK but its still a nuisance.

PC has...
AMD Duel Core 6000+ 3.1ghz
2 gig ram
NVidia 8800GT 512 meg
WinXP/SP2 DX9.0c

Its a pretty nice gaming system and gives no problems while playing. Theres something with that whistle and the IE icon, Im almost positive.

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mrsugg

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 2:56 am    Post subject:
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Hi Cyc2u and welcome to CastleCops,

Quote:
Hi all. I just got a new PC about 3 weeks ago.
I'm assuming it's under warranty? Take it back!


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Cyc2u

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:18 pm    Post subject:
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I took it back to them and told them to keep it a few days. They had it on 24/7 for 4 days total. They used it for searching the web and some of the guys were playing games on it. It never shut down on them once. He gave it back and told me to change my power cord. But i had already did that. I brought it back home, hooked it up and started it. It shut off in like 20 minutes without even touching it. It did this before i sent it to them also so it didnt have to do with a wierd noise or the IE icon like i said above.
While it was shut off I had a new plan to change outlets, so i unplugged the 6 way from the wall but it wouldnt reach the next closest plug so I scrapped that idea.
However, upon plugging the 6-way back into the wall and powering it up again, it hasnt shut down again. This is the 3rd day i had it back and it stays on all the time.
Bad 6-way, or do they need to be unplugged and plugged in every once in a while? Strangest PC problem ever, but it seems to be over for now. But does anyone have ideas why it acted up like that?

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Cyc2u

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:27 pm    Post subject:
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I forgot to mention....
While it was on I ran a virus scan with AntiVir.
It found a virus called Exp/office.Dropper.Gen and a file called 28c9742.msi in C:/windows/installer.
I quarentined it.
I cant find any info on this in english but maybe you guys would know if that file is responsible for shut downs?
I called them and the PC place said it wasnt really a virus but something to do with excel, which ive never used. Not sure what it all means.

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mrsugg

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:56 pm    Post subject:
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Plugs can be very fickle things! I'm glad that is sorted.

Quote:
I cant find any info on this in english
I don't know where you are looking, but a quick search on Google brings up several pages in English.

It is definitely malware: http://research.sunbelt-software.com/threatdisplay.aspx?name=Exploit.Office.Dropper.Gen&threatid=165897

To be sure you don't have anything else, I recommend that you work through the Malware Removal and Prevention procedure. This procedure has been designed to enable you to partially or even fully rid your computer of viruses, trojans, adware, and spyware. Be sure to carefully follow the directions in order to achieve the best results.

If you have any questions about any of the steps, then please post a new topic in the appropriate forum. There are links to them along the way. If you still need help when you finish, please read
these directions
for posting a topic in the Trend Micro HijackThis forum and a trained 1st responder or security expert will assist you.


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Cyc2u

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 3:38 am    Post subject:
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I spoke too soon and didnt knock on wood. It shut down again.
Good news is I found a way to make it shut down almost every time. If i play a game for a hour or so until the CPU fan is really cranking, then shut down the game, when the CPU fan starts to slow, itll shut off within 5 minutes. Thats usually within a half hour of shutting down a game. Im thinking the built-in fan is bad at detecting when to slow down and the PC shuts down before detonating. Wink
Also while it was running i removed my PC case side cover, and the PC went almost dead quiet whereas with it on it makes a much louder noise. Hmmm. So i put the cover back, waited until the sound rose back up and ran a test.
I rebooted, went to BIOS, H/W Monitor and checked temps.

The CPU went from 4200RPM to 4600RPM within a few minutes and stabilized.
CPU Temp = 139-141F
System Temp = 129-133F

Then i took the side cover off, gave it 10 minutes or so and reran the test.
The CPU was a steady 2900RPM
CPU Temp = 124F
System Temp = 122F

A big drop there!

So im wondering if its somehow overheating. The only thing that confuses me is that once in a while it shuts down overnight when i havent played anything in hours. But im wondering if the side cover isnt letting in enough air and it still overheats. Plus like i said theres no erratic behavior in any games i play and it never shuts off while playing. Sigh, im confused.

Also i did another virus scan, ran Adaware and hijackthis but its all clean. No infections besides the earlier one i mentioned above. I used the hijackthis.de site to copy/paste my log file and check but it all green checkmarks and everything seems ok.

Are those temps WAY too high or is that normal?
Those temps with the cover on are while its practically idle in BIOS so im sure they rise quite a bit more when playing a game.

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mrsugg

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 4:14 am    Post subject:
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Are you getting errors in your event logs? Go to start > run. In the box, type eventvwr. Look at the system and application log files and report any that are red. We need to know the Event ID and Source.

Quote:
...whereas with it on it makes a much louder noise.
What does this noise sound like and can you locate it's source?

This temp 122F=50C is marginal, but this one 141F=60.5C is getting pretty hot. How big are your fans (80mm, 120mm) and how many of them are there? Try running with the side of the case off and blow a house fan directly into the side. See if it shuts down.

Download SpeedFan and monitor your temps and fan speeds while doing things with and without the house fan.


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Cyc2u

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 5:03 am    Post subject:
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I didnt know about event viewer. Nice tool.
For today (2/9/0Cool i only have 1 red one and its right around the time it shut down. Im not positive on the exact time it shut down but im fairly certain it is. Ill definitely check the clock if it happens again.
Here is a screenshot of when i believe it shut down today.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c235/Cyclonicc/Eventviewer01.jpg
It doesnt seem like it gives much info though.

To answer about the noise, it is without a doubt the processor. When i put the side cover on the PC, its like its gasping for air. The fan starts spinning faster and faster, getting louder and louder. When i took the cover off i put my face right up to it, and the noise was definitely coming from the CPU fan.
With the cover off the RPMs dropped from 4600 to 2900 while idle.
And the temp from 140 to 125F.

For other fans, I only have the default one on top that blows out the back like most all PCs have. The side cover has 2 grated openings to let air in, but no fan. One of the grated openings has a sort of tunnel shape aiming towards the CPU. Against the back of the PC is a small black fan, unhooked, and i cannot find any wires to plug it in. I checked inside the whole PC and no connections even fit the plug on that fan.

For now im leaving that cover off. Tomorrow ill crank up a game for a while and see if it shuts down afterwards like its been doing. If it does ill check the time and event viewer. But im crossing my fingers and hoping overheating is the problem. A couple fans sound cheap lol.
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mrsugg

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 5:12 am    Post subject:
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Quote:
Against the back of the PC is a small black fan, unhooked, and i cannot find any wires to plug it in.
The CPU fan???? That isn't good. As it is still under warranty.... take it back again.

Quote:
They had it on 24/7 for 4 days total. They used it for searching the web and some of the guys were playing games on it. It never shut down on them once.
Many shops leave the sides off of the cases while doing their diagnostic work (it's just easier), so they might not have noticed the noise or the higher temps.

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Cyc2u

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 5:21 am    Post subject:
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It isnt the CPU fan, this is a secondary fan against the back part where everything plugs into the PC. The CPU fan is the one whirling loudly with the cover on.
I got SpeedFan and took a screenie.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c235/Cyclonicc/SpeedFan01.jpg

The bottom 2 show fire, lol. im sure thats not cool. Thats with the cover off and its nice and quiet too. Is it a problem?

I also noticed in BIOS that a feature called "AMD Cool & Quiet" was disabled. I didnt enable it because i dont know if im suppose to but "cool&quiet" sounds like what i need, and its off.

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mrsugg

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 3:29 pm    Post subject:
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Read these:

http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ProductInformation/0,,30_118_9485_9487%5E10272,00.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cool'n'Quiet
http://www.tech-recipes.com/windows_tips627.html

Sounds like it should help, but I am not familiar with it.

Changing settings in the BIOS can cause instability. Do so at your own risk.

I think that other fan should also be reconnected. The more airflow the better. Was it connected before you took it to the shop? If so, why didn't they reconnect it?


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Cyc2u

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 6:19 pm    Post subject:
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The other fan was never connected. I remember when i got it he said it was vibrating and the chord was running across the CPU so he didnt like it. Also, yes they always keep covers off the PCs in their shop, and its winter here and their desk that they keep the running PCs on is no more than 10 feet from the door. Meaning people are in and out all day so its naturally cold in there, which is why they never noticed overheating.

With the side cover off, I took your advice and grabbed a small 8" housefan, put it up to the PC as close as i could without touching it, and ran it on high while playing a game for over a hour. I shut down the game a hour or so ago, left the house fan running and *knock on wood* it hasnt shut down! Speed fan temps now show blue arrows pointing down instead of fire symbols.

So it appears, *FOR NOW*, hehe, that overheating is most likely the problem. It seems that the side cover is smothering the CPU and has no air flow. When i put the cover on, the CPU starts whining. When i remove the cover it goes quiet.

Ill keep testing and post any changes. Tuesday ill take it down and have them put a iceberg in there! Wink
Ill also ask them about Cool&Quiet. Id rather not mess with BIOS myself.

Thanks much for the input and tool links. Very handy. If it shuts down while this house fan is running then ill be positive overheating isnt the problem, because everything is running cold according to Speed Fan. Only time can tell. Ill keep playing around and see what happens.

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mrsugg

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 6:31 am    Post subject:
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Quote:
It seems that the side cover is smothering the CPU and has no air flow.
I think it more likely that the one fan is not providing the needed air flow inside the case. That second one is needed also to provide good bottom-to-top/front-to-back airflow.

Quote:
Ill keep testing and post any changes. Tuesday ill take it down and have them put a iceberg in there! Wink
Ill also ask them about Cool&Quiet. Id rather not mess with BIOS myself.


That sounds good. A couple of new fans is a pretty inexpensive fix if that is all it is.

Do keep us posted.

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